From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Dec 21 16:16:41 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F242B16A4CF for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:16:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from canning.wemm.org (canning.wemm.org [192.203.228.65]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F008143D68 for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:16:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from peter@evilpete.dyndns.org) Received: from fw.wemm.org (canning.wemm.org [192.203.228.65]) by canning.wemm.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD1182A7EA for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:16:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from peter@overcee.wemm.org) Received: from overcee.wemm.org (overcee.wemm.org [10.0.0.3]) by fw.wemm.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7BCA92C1AC for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:16:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from peter@overcee.wemm.org) Received: from overcee.wemm.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by overcee.wemm.org (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id hBM0GH7n025102 for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:16:17 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from peter@overcee.wemm.org) Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by overcee.wemm.org (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id hBM0GHQo025101 for mod-avail@freebsd.org; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:16:17 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from peter) From: Peter Wemm To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:16:17 -0800 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> Subject: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 00:16:41 -0000 Again, I'm sorry for dropping you all in the deep end like this. Here's the situation as best as I can describe. Right now, there are two mailing lists that have been changed into 'subscribers-only' posting. What this means is that we'll start catching legitimate posters, who won't be entirely happy to have to wait to participate in the mail threads. For this to work we need to have a fairly quick response time. Also, what happens is that anything that hits the mail filter triggers (spam, trolls, external mailing list subscriptions etc), will also get dropped in the moderator queue. When a new message gets held for moderator attention, the list manager sends an email to the moderator address. Once a day, it sends a "there are 3 messages waiting moderator approval" if there are any that have been sitting around for a while The actual moderator interface is fairly simple. You go to a web page, type a password (it sets a cookie so you dont have to do the password over and over again), and it presents you a form with a list of held messages, grouped by sender. There is a list of checkboxes. You can reject, approve or discard the messages. You can also add the sender's name to a list of 'always approve', 'always discard', 'always reject' addresses. That's all there is to it. Because its web form based, there is no chance of duplicate messages going onto the lists. However, if 3 people get the email all at once, and simultaniously go to the form, they'll all see the outstanding queue. Whoever clicks 'submit' first will win. For this reason, it is helpful to have a bit of coordination to try and minimize stomping of toes and duplication of effort. It also means that having too many cooks means that its more likely that multiple people will try and do this in parallel. Its not a big problem, it just can be a bit annoying if you log in and find that somebody already beat you to it or if somebody else processed the list you were working on. So, what I suggest is that we arrange for a couple of people who are often near a computer and email and can respond fairly quickly to take on each list. Ideally we should have people from different timezones to get best coverage. I imagine that these folks would do the primary work according to what they arrange amongst themselves. We can also have a couple of people act as backups in case sombody has an intrusion by Real Life for some reason, or if something has been sitting in the queue for a while. Under normal circumstances, the time required is probably around 30 seconds per hour or so. As for what to do when you've got the list of held messages, its really obvious which is the junk and which should go through. If in doubt, approve it (innocent till proven guilty) or ask for advice. These are technical lists, and tempers flare sometimes. We're looking to filter out trolls and really bogus stuff (mail lists, spam etc), not censor people who are being grumpy. People being grumpy is just a fact of life for the freebsd.org mailing lists. I'm not asking people to be censors or babysitters here, at least not for these lists, not yet. I really don't have a lot of experience at moderating stuff, so I can't say what works and what doesn't. I expect the people in the hot seat will just have to figure out what works for them. I would appreciate it a lot if the people who are willing to keep their 'hat in the ring' would stay subscribed here. I expect people will come and go from the various hot-seats and it would be really nice to have a group of people on standby to recruit from. :-) It seems we have a very good spread of people from around the world from different timezones. I know a couple of people said 'I really want to do this' while others said 'I'll help if nobody else is willing'. Can I get a quick ping from folks to let us know what they're willing to do given the info above? Some of you told me you're near a computer all day at work, or you work from home, etc. That and what kind of times you're near a computer is the most useful to know. Don't feel shy. :-) And again, thanks a lot for your interest. -- Peter Wemm - peter@wemm.org; peter@FreeBSD.org; peter@yahoo-inc.com "All of this is for nothing if we don't go to the stars" - JMS/B5 From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Dec 21 16:44:27 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 982A116A4CE for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:44:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from ns1.tcbug.org (12-218-40-24.client.mchsi.com [12.218.40.24]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2AAED43D5E for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:44:26 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from friar_josh@ns1.tcbug.org) Received: by ns1.tcbug.org (Postfix, from userid 1003) id 53FA6BAD5; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 18:43:55 +0000 (GMT) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 18:43:55 +0000 From: Josh Paetzel To: Peter Wemm Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list Message-ID: <20031221184354.GB32419@ns1.tcbug.org> References: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 00:44:27 -0000 On Sun, Dec 21, 2003 at 04:16:17PM -0800, Peter Wemm wrote: > Again, I'm sorry for dropping you all in the deep end like this. Here's > the situation as best as I can describe. Don't be sorry...sounds like you're doing the best job possible to deal with the situation at hand. > > > So, what I suggest is that we arrange for a couple of people who are > often near a computer and email and can respond fairly quickly to take > on each list. Ideally we should have people from different timezones > to get best coverage. I imagine that these folks would do the primary > work according to what they arrange amongst themselves. We can also > have a couple of people act as backups in case sombody has an intrusion > by Real Life for some reason, or if something has been sitting in the > queue for a while. Under normal circumstances, the time required is > probably around 30 seconds per hour or so. > > As for what to do when you've got the list of held messages, its really > obvious which is the junk and which should go through. If in doubt, > approve it (innocent till proven guilty) or ask for advice. These are > technical lists, and tempers flare sometimes. We're looking to filter > out trolls and really bogus stuff (mail lists, spam etc), not censor > people who are being grumpy. People being grumpy is just a fact of > life for the freebsd.org mailing lists. I'm not asking people to be > censors or babysitters here, at least not for these lists, not yet. > > I really don't have a lot of experience at moderating stuff, so I can't > say what works and what doesn't. I expect the people in the hot seat > will just have to figure out what works for them. > Anyone who's been reading the lists for a while should have a feel for what's typical and what isn't I would think. > It seems we have a very good spread of people from around the world from > different timezones. I know a couple of people said 'I really want to > do this' while others said 'I'll help if nobody else is willing'. Can > I get a quick ping from folks to let us know what they're willing to do > given the info above? Some of you told me you're near a computer all > day at work, or you work from home, etc. That and what kind of times > you're near a computer is the most useful to know. Don't feel > shy. :-) > > And again, thanks a lot for your interest. > -- > Peter Wemm - peter@wemm.org; peter@FreeBSD.org; peter@yahoo-inc.com > "All of this is for nothing if we don't go to the stars" - JMS/B5 I'm currently working from home, and check the mailing lists for traffic about every 15-30 minutes. I'm on from about 8am - 8pm Central US time (-6 GMT IIRC) As I indicated in my original reply, I'm familiar with the admin interface to mailman, and interested in helping out in any way shape or form. Josh Paetzel From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Dec 21 16:47:13 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E104A16A4CE for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:47:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from desolation.livid.de (portal.aphroland.org [216.39.174.24]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A43B143D3F for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:47:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from damm@yazzy.org) Received: by desolation.livid.de (Postfix, from userid 500) id 9E1F28D6EBD; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:45:43 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list From: Scott Likens To: mod-avail@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> References: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <1072053942.25641.1.camel@desolation.livid.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:45:42 -0800 X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 00:47:14 -0000 On Sun, 2003-12-21 at 16:16, Peter Wemm wrote: > Again, I'm sorry for dropping you all in the deep end like this. Here's > the situation as best as I can describe. > > Right now, there are two mailing lists that have been changed into > 'subscribers-only' posting. What this means is that we'll start > catching legitimate posters, who won't be entirely happy to have to > wait to participate in the mail threads. For this to work we need to > have a fairly quick response time. > > Also, what happens is that anything that hits the mail filter triggers > (spam, trolls, external mailing list subscriptions etc), will also get > dropped in the moderator queue. > > When a new message gets held for moderator attention, the list manager > sends an email to the moderator address. Once a day, it sends a "there > are 3 messages waiting moderator approval" if there are any that have > been sitting around for a while > > The actual moderator interface is fairly simple. You go to a web page, > type a password (it sets a cookie so you dont have to do the password > over and over again), and it presents you a form with a list of held > messages, grouped by sender. > > There is a list of checkboxes. You can reject, approve or discard the > messages. You can also add the sender's name to a list of 'always > approve', 'always discard', 'always reject' addresses. That's all there > is to it. > > Because its web form based, there is no chance of duplicate messages > going onto the lists. However, if 3 people get the email all at once, > and simultaniously go to the form, they'll all see the outstanding > queue. Whoever clicks 'submit' first will win. For this reason, it is > helpful to have a bit of coordination to try and minimize stomping of > toes and duplication of effort. It also means that having too many > cooks means that its more likely that multiple people will try and do > this in parallel. Its not a big problem, it just can be a bit annoying > if you log in and find that somebody already beat you to it or if > somebody else processed the list you were working on. > > So, what I suggest is that we arrange for a couple of people who are > often near a computer and email and can respond fairly quickly to take > on each list. Ideally we should have people from different timezones > to get best coverage. I imagine that these folks would do the primary > work according to what they arrange amongst themselves. We can also > have a couple of people act as backups in case sombody has an intrusion > by Real Life for some reason, or if something has been sitting in the > queue for a while. Under normal circumstances, the time required is > probably around 30 seconds per hour or so. > > As for what to do when you've got the list of held messages, its really > obvious which is the junk and which should go through. If in doubt, > approve it (innocent till proven guilty) or ask for advice. These are > technical lists, and tempers flare sometimes. We're looking to filter > out trolls and really bogus stuff (mail lists, spam etc), not censor > people who are being grumpy. People being grumpy is just a fact of > life for the freebsd.org mailing lists. I'm not asking people to be > censors or babysitters here, at least not for these lists, not yet. > > I really don't have a lot of experience at moderating stuff, so I can't > say what works and what doesn't. I expect the people in the hot seat > will just have to figure out what works for them. > > I would appreciate it a lot if the people who are willing to keep their > 'hat in the ring' would stay subscribed here. I expect people will > come and go from the various hot-seats and it would be really nice to > have a group of people on standby to recruit from. :-) > > It seems we have a very good spread of people from around the world from > different timezones. I know a couple of people said 'I really want to > do this' while others said 'I'll help if nobody else is willing'. Can > I get a quick ping from folks to let us know what they're willing to do > given the info above? Some of you told me you're near a computer all > day at work, or you work from home, etc. That and what kind of times > you're near a computer is the most useful to know. Don't feel > shy. :-) > > And again, thanks a lot for your interest. Ok, that sounds quite do-able. I do know that I am more then willing to put in an hour or two nightly in this 'interface' I doubt it would require that much effort or time. But the idea is to help as much as possible. But, I'm willing and able. Just let me know when and where and i'm there. Scott -- "I think we ought to be out there doing what we do best - making large holes in other people's countries." - George Carlin From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Dec 21 16:57:22 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C2A216A4CE for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:57:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from kundenserver16.yws-admin.de (kundenserver16.yws-admin.de [217.115.154.106]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23A9443D58 for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:57:21 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from flo@kasimir.com) Received: from kasimir.com (p5087595C.dip.t-dialin.net [80.135.89.92]) by kundenserver16.yws-admin.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D633352587; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 01:57:19 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <3FE6416E.9030409@kasimir.com> Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 01:57:18 +0100 From: "Florian C. Smeets" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031213 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Peter Wemm Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list References: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> In-Reply-To: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 00:57:22 -0000 Peter Wemm wrote: > It seems we have a very good spread of people from around the world from > different timezones. I know a couple of people said 'I really want to > do this' while others said 'I'll help if nobody else is willing'. Can > I get a quick ping from folks to let us know what they're willing to do > given the info above? Some of you told me you're near a computer all > day at work, or you work from home, etc. That and what kind of times > you're near a computer is the most useful to know. Don't feel > shy. :-) I work from about 9 or 10 am till 6 or 7 pm CET. During this time i have internet access and would be able to recieve mail and approve/reject mails to the list. Usually i also spend some time on my computer at home in the evening from about 9 pm to 11 pm there i also have unlimited internet access. I have been reading -current for a year or so and i'm subscribed to -hackers since about 7 months. I wold really like to help out. Regards, flo From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Dec 21 17:00:22 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E79D16A4D2 for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:00:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.soaustin.net (mail.soaustin.net [207.200.4.66]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F33643D64 for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:00:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from linimon@lonesome.com) Received: from lonesome.com (cs242719-195.austin.rr.com [24.27.19.195]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-MD5 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.soaustin.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5E19140AB for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 19:00:19 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <3FE64085.7080100@lonesome.com> Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 18:53:25 -0600 From: Mark Linimon User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.3.1) Gecko/20030713 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org References: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> In-Reply-To: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [mod-avail] Suggestion: statement of purpose X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 01:00:22 -0000 Here's my first suggestion on what we ought to do about the change in the mailing list situation: we ought to go ahead and create a brief public document saying what we're doing and why, and then go ahead and post it to Slashdot. Sooner or later the mindless speculation and meta-trolling will hit there anyway so we might as well fire the first shot across the bow. My suggested text would pick up the themes from the welcome message and run something like this: ---------- FreeBSD announces restrictions on mailing list postings Historically, the FreeBSD mailing lists have been open to postings from any email address, not just from list subscribers. The theory has been that more openness will encourage more people to participate, and in particular feel welcome to ask questions. However, on a regularly occurring basis, the mailing lists have been abused. In particular, the abuse has repeatedly taken the form of the various mailing lists being subscribed to other, random mailing lists from all over the Internet. These subscriptions have happened in batches as many as 20 or 30 at a time. Not only does this fill up innocent bystanders' mailboxes, it also fills up the archives, and causes people to have to waste time with unsubscribing. Then, of course, there is the meta-discussion of what all this is about, and why it's happening, and so on and so forth, and it takes days to settle down. Frankly, these actions don't do anyone in the open source and Free Software communities any good. All it does is waste time: after all, you can't be writing code or fixing bugs while you're working on administrivia. Therefore, with reluctance, the project has decided to restrict postings to certain mailings lists to subscribers only, for an experimental period of time. It's a shame to have to do this, of course, but on the other hand anyone with an email address already gets plenty of unwanted email in their inbox and thus can understand the motivation. A related problem has been about using the web-based form to submit Problem Reports to the project. This form had also been regularly abused by sending bogus entries to the PR database, in one case several dozen at a time. Again, flushing these entries from the PR database wastes volunteer time. For some number of months the best solution was seen to be to disable this form entirely -- a great inconvenience to users, especially new FreeBSD users who are having problems setting up their initial email configuration to use send-pr(1) from their own box. Finally, some volunteer effort has resulted in the web form being re-enabled, with various filters and security checks to make it less vulnerable to abuse. So that's the situation as it stands today. We apologize to our user community for these restrictions, which no one is really happy about imposing, but at some point there's really no other choice. ------ So what's the list's reaction to this proposal? mcl From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Dec 21 17:00:46 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D04B916A4CE for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:00:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from bast.unixathome.org (bast.unixathome.org [66.11.174.150]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F253443D5D for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:00:45 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dan@langille.org) Received: from wocker (wocker.unixathome.org [192.168.0.99]) by bast.unixathome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC33F3D28 for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 20:00:40 -0500 (EST) From: "Dan Langille" To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 20:00:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list Message-ID: <3FE5FBE8.25255.A230F397@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <3FE6416E.9030409@kasimir.com> References: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 01:00:46 -0000 On 22 Dec 2003 at 1:57, Florian C. Smeets wrote: > I work from about 9 or 10 am till 6 or 7 pm CET. During this time i > have internet access and would be able to recieve mail and > approve/reject mails to the list. Usually i also spend some time on my > computer at home in the evening from about 9 pm to 11 pm there i also > have unlimited internet access. I'm on the computer from about 7:30am EST until about 5pm EST and various hours after that. I read -hackers mostly. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Dec 21 17:26:06 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3AB6816A4CE for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:26:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk (happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk [81.2.69.218]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DF5243D69 for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:26:03 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from m.seaman@infracaninophile.co.uk) Received: from happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk (localhost [127.0.0.1]) hBM1PwZ6062481 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Mon, 22 Dec 2003 01:25:58 GMT (envelope-from matthew@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk) Received: (from matthew@localhost)id hBM1PwPI062480; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 01:25:58 GMT (envelope-from matthew) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 01:25:58 +0000 From: Matthew Seaman To: Peter Wemm Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list Message-ID: <20031222012557.GA62183@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> References: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="WIyZ46R2i8wDzkSu" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.5.1i X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.7 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,WORK_AT_HOME autolearn=no version=2.61 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.61 (1.212.2.1-2003-12-09-exp) on happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 01:26:06 -0000 --WIyZ46R2i8wDzkSu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Dec 21, 2003 at 04:16:17PM -0800, Peter Wemm wrote: > It seems we have a very good spread of people from around the world from= =20 > different timezones. I know a couple of people said 'I really want to= =20 > do this' while others said 'I'll help if nobody else is willing'. Can=20 > I get a quick ping from folks to let us know what they're willing to do= =20 > given the info above? Some of you told me you're near a computer all > day at work, or you work from home, etc. That and what kind of times=20 > you're near a computer is the most useful to know. Don't feel=20 > shy. :-) I seem to be sat in front of this machine from about 09:00 to 21:00 GMT most days. Quite why I'm still mucking about on this thing at 01:30 tonight I just don't know. Covering that 09:00 -- 12:00 GMT block before most of the US users wake up would suit me just fine. Night all, Matthew --=20 Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil. 26 The Paddocks Savill Way PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Marlow Tel: +44 1628 476614 Bucks., SL7 1TH UK --WIyZ46R2i8wDzkSu Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQE/5kgldtESqEQa7a0RAlFgAJ4xyOe3tC2GKsNhGjVznY+41cjQxQCgmvV3 9iEBqgNHweXGk9cJFnUERVc= =HAtx -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --WIyZ46R2i8wDzkSu-- From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Dec 21 17:26:20 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3CE8416A4CE for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:26:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from mhub-w6.tc.umn.edu (mhub-w6.tc.umn.edu [160.94.160.36]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8594743D69 for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:26:18 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ryans@gamersimpact.com) Received: from [24.107.70.120] by mhub-w6.tc.umn.edu with ESMTP; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 19:26:17 -0600 Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list From: Ryan Sommers To: Peter Wemm , mod-avail@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> References: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1072056174.715.29.camel@localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 19:22:54 -0600 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 01:26:20 -0000 On Sun, 2003-12-21 at 18:16, Peter Wemm wrote: > When a new message gets held for moderator attention, the list manager > sends an email to the moderator address. Once a day, it sends a "there > are 3 messages waiting moderator approval" if there are any that have > been sitting around for a while > Just my opinion but I'd rather not get an email for every queued message. This will just add to our spam. I think if we have a quality team of moderators this will be unnecessary anyway. Most of us will likely check the mod queue as often as we check mail. If it's possible I'd almost rather have a summary sent once every 3 hours or so if there are messages awaiting moderation. This would make it so if say 10 spam messages came in within the time period we don't get 10 "Message waiting" mails and just one "10 messages waiting". This is likely to be a bikeshed though so I'm not gonna push anything. > We're looking to filter > out trolls and really bogus stuff (mail lists, spam etc), not censor > people who are being grumpy. People being grumpy is just a fact of Saying we're here to filter trolls might be a tough thing to define. Afterall no one believes themselves to be a troll. I agree they can get annoying but we might need to refine the definition of "troll." > I get a quick ping from folks to let us know what they're willing to do > given the info above? Some of you told me you're near a computer all > day at work, or you work from home, etc. That and what kind of times > you're near a computer is the most useful to know. Don't feel > shy. :-) > I'm basically around the computer from 9am to midnight (GMT-6, central usa) (the joys and pains of a widespread wireless network) and check mail every half hour at the least. I'd be available to drop by the queue interface during any or all of this time. Just let me know. -- Ryan "leadZERO" Sommers Gamer's Impact President ryans@gamersimpact.com ICQ: 1019590 AIM/MSN: leadZERO -= http://www.gamersimpact.com =- From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Dec 21 17:38:37 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B39A16A4CE for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:38:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from nox.cx (nox.cx [216.12.18.14]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3445A43D62 for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:38:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from zakj-freebsd-mod@nox.cx) Received: (qmail 28356 invoked by uid 1000); 22 Dec 2003 01:38:57 -0000 Message-ID: <20031222013857.28355.qmail@nox.cx> Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 20:38:57 -0500 From: Zak Johnson To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list Mail-Followup-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org References: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 01:38:37 -0000 On 2003-12-21 16:16-0800, Peter Wemm wrote: > Can > I get a quick ping from folks to let us know what they're willing to do > given the info above? Some of you told me you're near a computer all > day at work, or you work from home, etc. That and what kind of times > you're near a computer is the most useful to know. Hello all, and thanks Peter for taking the initiative to moderate these lists; the recent abuse was quite annoying. I tend to be around a computer most of my waking hours (Eastern US time), but most reliably between 0830 and 1830 Eastern. I would love to moderate whenever I can most be of help. -Zak From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Dec 21 17:40:12 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 45C6916A4CE for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:40:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from rutger.owt.com (rutger.owt.com [204.118.6.16]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2238D43D50 for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:40:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kstewart@owt.com) Received: from topaz-out (owt-207-41-94-233.owt.com [207.41.94.233]) by rutger.owt.com (8.11.6p2/8.9.3) with ESMTP id hBM1e5u28642; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:40:05 -0800 From: Kent Stewart To: Peter Wemm Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:40:05 -0800 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> <3FE6416E.9030409@kasimir.com> In-Reply-To: <3FE6416E.9030409@kasimir.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200312211740.05194.kstewart@owt.com> cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 01:40:12 -0000 I may be in the PST timezone but my hours are more like Hawaii time. I am available from 10-11 am PST to 2:30 pm. Then, it varies until around 10 pm to 3am or so. I follow both hackers and current. I have never been involved with moderating but it has been forced upon us. Kent -- Kent Stewart Richland, WA http://users.owt.com/kstewart/index.html From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Dec 21 17:43:41 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94E3916A4CE for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:43:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from ns1.tcbug.org (12-218-40-24.client.mchsi.com [12.218.40.24]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF14343D4C for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:43:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from friar_josh@ns1.tcbug.org) Received: by ns1.tcbug.org (Postfix, from userid 1003) id 42B95BA66; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 19:43:04 +0000 (GMT) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 19:43:03 +0000 From: Josh Paetzel To: Ryan Sommers Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list Message-ID: <20031221194302.GC32419@ns1.tcbug.org> References: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> <1072056174.715.29.camel@localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <1072056174.715.29.camel@localhost> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 01:43:41 -0000 On Sun, Dec 21, 2003 at 07:22:54PM -0600, Ryan Sommers wrote: > On Sun, 2003-12-21 at 18:16, Peter Wemm wrote: > > When a new message gets held for moderator attention, the list manager > > sends an email to the moderator address. Once a day, it sends a "there > > are 3 messages waiting moderator approval" if there are any that have > > been sitting around for a while > > > > Just my opinion but I'd rather not get an email for every queued > message. This will just add to our spam. I think if we have a quality > team of moderators this will be unnecessary anyway. Most of us will > likely check the mod queue as often as we check mail. > > If it's possible I'd almost rather have a summary sent once every 3 > hours or so if there are messages awaiting moderation. This would make > it so if say 10 spam messages came in within the time period we don't > get 10 "Message waiting" mails and just one "10 messages waiting". > > This is likely to be a bikeshed though so I'm not gonna push anything. I don't believe there's any way of changing this particular behaviour of mailman aside from hacking it. > > > We're looking to filter > > out trolls and really bogus stuff (mail lists, spam etc), not censor > > people who are being grumpy. People being grumpy is just a fact of > > Saying we're here to filter trolls might be a tough thing to define. > Afterall no one believes themselves to be a troll. I agree they can get > annoying but we might need to refine the definition of "troll." > I think we have rather clear guidelines as to what is acceptable or unacceptable behaviour on the lists. http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/eresources.html#ERESOURCES-MAIL Section C.1.3 covers the list charters. Josh Paetzel From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Dec 21 17:45:07 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F9ED16A4CE for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:45:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from cain.gsoft.com.au (cain.gsoft.com.au [203.31.81.10]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A3EF43D5C for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:45:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Received: from chowder.gsoft.com.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by cain.gsoft.com.au (8.12.9/8.12.8) with ESMTP id hBM1iwE7030424; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 12:14:58 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) From: "Daniel O'Connor" To: Peter Wemm Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 12:14:55 +1030 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.3 References: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> In-Reply-To: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200312221214.55548.doconnor@gsoft.com.au> X-Spam-Score: -4.2 () CARRIAGE_RETURNS,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,SPAM_PHRASE_02_03,SUBJECT_IS_LIST,USER_AGENT,USER_AGENT_KMAIL,WORK_AT_HOME X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.16 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 01:45:07 -0000 On Monday 22 December 2003 10:46, Peter Wemm wrote: > The actual moderator interface is fairly simple. You go to a web page, > type a password (it sets a cookie so you dont have to do the password > over and over again), and it presents you a form with a list of held > messages, grouped by sender. > > There is a list of checkboxes. You can reject, approve or discard the > messages. You can also add the sender's name to a list of 'always > approve', 'always discard', 'always reject' addresses. That's all there > is to it. Is it mailman? :) > I would appreciate it a lot if the people who are willing to keep their > 'hat in the ring' would stay subscribed here. I expect people will > come and go from the various hot-seats and it would be really nice to > have a group of people on standby to recruit from. :-) > > It seems we have a very good spread of people from around the world from > different timezones. I know a couple of people said 'I really want to > do this' while others said 'I'll help if nobody else is willing'. Can > I get a quick ping from folks to let us know what they're willing to do > given the info above? Some of you told me you're near a computer all I'm more than happy to help out. > day at work, or you work from home, etc. That and what kind of times > you're near a computer is the most useful to know. Don't feel > shy. :-) I am permanently glued to my computer at work.. 22:30 UT -> 06:30 UT weekdays 16:30 EST -> 00:30 EST weekdays Probably add 2-3 hours to those on weekends. IMHO the idea of 'batching' requests so they're only sent out every few hours made by Ryan sounds good, although it doesn't really matter. Presumably the moderate request has a header that can be filtered on. -- Daniel O'Connor software and network engineer for Genesis Software - http://www.gsoft.com.au "The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from." -- Andrew Tanenbaum GPG Fingerprint - 9A8C 569F 685A D928 5140 AE4B 319B 41F4 5D17 FDD5 From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Dec 21 17:50:56 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93B4C16A4CE for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:50:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from desolation.livid.de (portal.aphroland.org [216.39.174.24]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06D5D43D58 for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:50:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from damm@yazzy.org) Received: by desolation.livid.de (Postfix, from userid 500) id 8674C8D6EBA; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:49:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list From: Scott Likens To: mod-avail@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> References: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <1072057766.26242.3.camel@desolation.livid.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:49:26 -0800 X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 01:50:56 -0000 oh yeah and i'm available from 5pm pst to 10pm pst, and a litle in the morning around 5am pst. -- "I think we ought to be out there doing what we do best - making large holes in other people's countries." - George Carlin From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Dec 21 18:52:39 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C05E16A4CE for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 18:52:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from bunrab.catwhisker.org (adsl-63-193-123-122.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.193.123.122]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26DF843D5A for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 18:52:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from david@catwhisker.org) Received: from bunrab.catwhisker.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) hBM2qWLr097602 for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 18:52:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from david@bunrab.catwhisker.org) Received: (from david@localhost) by bunrab.catwhisker.org (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id hBM2qWQH097601 for mod-avail@freebsd.org; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 18:52:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from david) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 18:52:32 -0800 (PST) From: David Wolfskill Message-Id: <200312220252.hBM2qWQH097601@bunrab.catwhisker.org> To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list In-Reply-To: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 02:52:39 -0000 >From: Peter Wemm >To: mod-avail@freebsd.org >Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:16:17 -0800 >Subject: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list >Again, I'm sorry for dropping you all in the deep end like this. Here's >the situation as best as I can describe. I'll join the chorus thanking Peter for initiating this, and point out (in case it's of use) that I'm acting as postmaster@freebsd.org. [That may help provide some understanding for remarks below.] As such, I am keenly appreciative of your collective efforts. :-) Please also note that I'm responding to a bunch of posts in a single message. :-} >When a new message gets held for moderator attention, the list manager >sends an email to the moderator address. Once a day, it sends a "there >are 3 messages waiting moderator approval" if there are any that have >been sitting around for a while It may be useful to mention that IIRC, this happens around 0800 hrs. US/Pacific (1600 hrs. GMT/UTC at this time of year). >The actual moderator interface is fairly simple. You go to a web page, >type a password (it sets a cookie so you dont have to do the password >over and over again), and it presents you a form with a list of held >messages, grouped by sender. Note that mailman's memory of the cookie persists only as long as the current Web browser instantiation (and appears to be stored in some table of finite capacity, though that ought not be an issue with folks only dealing with one or two lists). >There is a list of checkboxes. You can reject, approve or discard the >messages. You can also add the sender's name to a list of 'always >approve', 'always discard', 'always reject' addresses. That's all there >is to it. Note that we have had spams with (effectively) forged headers; I would thus be reluctant to recommend trusting that kind of information to make an "always approve" decision. (I have added a few addresses to "always discard," but those tend to be highly implausible for legitimate posters. >... >As for what to do when you've got the list of held messages, its really >obvious which is the junk and which should go through. If in doubt, >approve it (innocent till proven guilty) or ask for advice. These are >technical lists, and tempers flare sometimes. We're looking to filter >out trolls and really bogus stuff (mail lists, spam etc), not censor >people who are being grumpy. People being grumpy is just a fact of >life for the freebsd.org mailing lists. I'm not asking people to be >censors or babysitters here, at least not for these lists, not yet. I'd like to propose a slight modification: It seems to me that we're trying to alleviate the perceived ill effects of a change to the status quo -- that is, folks who post from unsubscribed addresses suddenly have their posts delayed now. Thus, if the majority of the new volunteers were to merely attend to approving posts from non-subscribed (but otherwise legitimate) posters, I think that would do for now. That would leave the spam for me to deal with, which I generally do once or twice per day. (In addition to discarding the spam, I tell spamassassin about the decision. And in the case of a message that was held because it was incorrectly marke das "possible spam," I tell spamassassin that it isn't either spam.) >I really don't have a lot of experience at moderating stuff, so I can't >say what works and what doesn't. I expect the people in the hot seat >will just have to figure out what works for them. I've been getting a certain amount of experience.... :-} >.... >It seems we have a very good spread of people from around the world from >different timezones. I know a couple of people said 'I really want to >do this' while others said 'I'll help if nobody else is willing'. Can >I get a quick ping from folks to let us know what they're willing to do >given the info above? Some of you told me you're near a computer all >day at work, or you work from home, etc. That and what kind of times >you're near a computer is the most useful to know. Don't feel >shy. :-) OK; I normally make a pass through the "held for moderation" posts between about 0600 - 0700 hrs. US/Pacific (1400 - 1500 GMT/UTC). Depending on the day's activities, I may be glued to a computer all day, in which case, I have a chance to monitor the number of held posts, and when it gets to a "high-water mark," I caqn make another pass. Or I may be out "in the field" installing antennae or up on a ridge, in which case I probably won't have much connectivity. And in the evening (US/Pacific), if I'm home, I may have another chance to make a pass -- or I might be at an evening meeting, some of which have connectivity (BayLISA) and some of which don't (BAFUG). >From owner-mod-avail@freebsd.org Sun Dec 21 .... 2003 >Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 18:53:25 -0600 >From: Mark Linimon >Cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org >Subject: [mod-avail] Suggestion: statement of purpose >Here's my first suggestion on what we ought to do about >the change in the mailing list situation: we ought to go ahead >and create a brief public document saying what we're doing >and why, and then go ahead and post it to Slashdot. Eh. No opinion; I read /. so seldom -- it's a toss-up whether I read /. more often or watch TV more often -- neither one accounts for more than a negligible amount of my time, generally. >... >However, on a regularly occurring basis, the mailing lists have >been abused. In particular, the abuse has repeatedly taken the >form of the various mailing lists being subscribed to other, random >mailing lists from all over the Internet. These subscriptions have >happened in batches as many as 20 or 30 at a time. Not only >does this fill up innocent bystanders' mailboxes, it also fills up the >archives, and causes people to have to waste time with unsubscribing. >Then, of course, there is the meta-discussion of what all this is about, >and why it's happening, and so on and so forth, and it takes days >to settle down. Ummm... unless I've been asleep at the switch, I believe that the actual posts to the FreeBSD lists from the spam lists have been squelched or avoided. >So what's the list's reaction to this proposal? Save for the above comment, it seems OK, though I have no clue whether posting to /. would be useful. >From owner-mod-avail@freebsd.org Sun Dec 21 17:26:32 2003 >Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list >From: Ryan Sommers >To: Peter Wemm , mod-avail@freebsd.org >Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 19:22:54 -0600 >Just my opinion but I'd rather not get an email for every queued >message. This will just add to our spam. I think if we have a quality >team of moderators this will be unnecessary anyway. Most of us will >likely check the mod queue as often as we check mail. >If it's possible I'd almost rather have a summary sent once every 3 >hours or so if there are messages awaiting moderation. This would make >it so if say 10 spam messages came in within the time period we don't >get 10 "Message waiting" mails and just one "10 messages waiting". Well, perhaps folks could just try looking at the Web page, vs. being prompted by getting more mail? >This is likely to be a bikeshed though so I'm not gonna push anything. I appreciate your restraint. :-) >> We're looking to filter >> out trolls and really bogus stuff (mail lists, spam etc), not censor >> people who are being grumpy. People being grumpy is just a fact of >Saying we're here to filter trolls might be a tough thing to define. >Afterall no one believes themselves to be a troll. I agree they can get >annoying but we might need to refine the definition of "troll." Another reason it might be better to leave that part for me, and for the rest of y'all to just ensure that appropriate posts from non-subscribed addresses get posted to the lists in a reasonable time-frame? >From owner-mod-avail@freebsd.org Sun Dec 21 17:43:57 2003 >Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 19:43:03 +0000 >From: Josh Paetzel >To: Ryan Sommers >Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list >Cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org >Sender: owner-mod-avail@freebsd.org >> Just my opinion but I'd rather not get an email for every queued >> message. This will just add to our spam. I think if we have a quality >> team of moderators this will be unnecessary anyway. Most of us will >> likely check the mod queue as often as we check mail. >> If it's possible I'd almost rather have a summary sent once every 3 >> hours or so if there are messages awaiting moderation. This would make >> it so if say 10 spam messages came in within the time period we don't >> get 10 "Message waiting" mails and just one "10 messages waiting". >I don't believe there's any way of changing this particular behaviour of >mailman aside from hacking it. There is apair of buttons under "Privacy options/Sender filters," near the bottom; one is a radio button for "Action to take for postings from non-members for which no explicit action is defined." -- options are * Accept * Hold [curent selection] * Reject * Discard The other reads "Should messages from non-members, which are automatically discarded, be forwarded to the list moderator?" -- options are * No * Yes [currently selected] Perhaps it's just as easy as selecting "no"? >From owner-mod-avail@freebsd.org Sun Dec 21 17:45:23 2003 >From: "Daniel O'Connor" >To: Peter Wemm >Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list >Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 12:14:55 +1030 >Cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org >Is it mailman? >:) Yup. :-) >IMHO the idea of 'batching' requests so they're only sent out every few hours >made by Ryan sounds good, although it doesn't really matter. Presumably the >moderate request has a header that can be filtered on. Yes. /^Subject:\w+\[Moderators\]/ would be a matching (Perl) regex, I believe. [End of responses -- dhw] Thanks again for your willingness to help! Peace, david (current hat: postmaster@freebsd.org) -- David H. Wolfskill david@catwhisker.org If you want true virus-protection for your PC, install a non-Microsoft OS on it. Plausible candidates include FreeBSD, Linux, NetBSD, OpenBSD, and Solaris (in alphabetical order). From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Dec 21 20:42:13 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C49B816A4CE for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 20:42:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.soaustin.net (mail.soaustin.net [207.200.4.66]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A229C43D41 for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 20:42:10 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from linimon@lonesome.com) Received: from lonesome.com (cs242719-195.austin.rr.com [24.27.19.195]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-MD5 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.soaustin.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8CEB140AB for ; Sun, 21 Dec 2003 22:42:08 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <3FE6747C.9000702@lonesome.com> Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 22:35:08 -0600 From: Mark Linimon User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.3.1) Gecko/20030713 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list References: <200312220252.hBM2qWQH097601@bunrab.catwhisker.org> In-Reply-To: <200312220252.hBM2qWQH097601@bunrab.catwhisker.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 04:42:13 -0000 David Wolfskill wrote: >Ummm... unless I've been asleep at the switch, I believe that the actual >posts to the FreeBSD lists from the spam lists have been squelched or >avoided. > > My comments weren't meant as any kind of knock, on the system I co-administer we have postfix/procmail/spamassassin, it's constantly maintained, and still I just got a P4r1s Hi1t0n email that made it all the way through. And since we're a small system, I Can Just Imagine :-( My own personal concerns are more the troll than the spam. And that's a people-problem, not a technical problem, and thus not easily solved. (I remember being Very Much Not Amused by the sequence of the 30 or 40 "I'm so stoned"/"FreeBSD sucks" that showed up one day; that was clearly very intentional trolling). >>So what's the list's reaction to this proposal? >> >>Save for the above comment, it seems OK, though I have no clue whether >>posting to /. would be useful. >> >> Oh lord, don't put me on to having to defend posting anything on /. as being "useful" :-) What I'm concerned about is the "public relations" angle. Clearly at least one /. reader (my guess is, our troll himself) will take anything that FreeBSD does and put a negative spin on it. Why not try to head that particular spin off at the pass by saying, hey, you're the one putting us behind the 8-ball, not vice versa? That's what I'm attempting to do by proposing this post. I mean, I can live with or without it, that's just my slant on this. mcl From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Dec 22 00:47:37 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C94116A4CE for ; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 00:47:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.droso.net (koala.droso.net [193.162.142.74]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71FE343D53 for ; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 00:47:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from erwin@mail.droso.net) Received: by mail.droso.net (Postfix, from userid 1001) id AA5062282C; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 09:47:33 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 09:47:33 +0100 From: Erwin Lansing To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list Message-ID: <20031222084733.GA53836@droso.net> References: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="AqsLC8rIMeq19msA" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i X-Operating-System: FreeBSD/i386 5.1-CURRENT X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 08:47:37 -0000 --AqsLC8rIMeq19msA Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Dec 21, 2003 at 04:16:17PM -0800, Peter Wemm wrote: >=20 > So, what I suggest is that we arrange for a couple of people who are=20 > often near a computer and email and can respond fairly quickly to take=20 > on each list. Ideally we should have people from different timezones=20 > to get best coverage. Let me join the european team then, at work I'm constantly in front of my screen (8-16 CET) and at home I'm usually either in front of it or just around the corner from my screen until about 23pm (CET). Same goes for weekends. --=20 _._ _,-'""`-._ Erwin Lansing (,-.`._,'( |\`-/| erwin@lansing.dk http://droso.org `-.-' \ )-`( , o o) erwin@FreeBSD.org -bf- `- \`_`"'- --AqsLC8rIMeq19msA Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQE/5q+lqy9aWxUlaZARAv3cAKCTnBm9XB13UFvIbXP9Dd054FUxywCfbSpw l7UgE2aMZiixgmv4QJZspEI= =ub+W -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --AqsLC8rIMeq19msA-- From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Dec 22 01:34:40 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8809316A4CE for ; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 01:34:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-gw0.york.ac.uk (mail-gw0.york.ac.uk [144.32.128.245]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D83143D7F for ; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 01:33:54 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gavin.atkinson@ury.york.ac.uk) Received: from [144.32.226.160] (buffy.york.ac.uk [144.32.226.160]) by mail-gw0.york.ac.uk (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id hBM9XoWi028991; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 09:33:50 GMT Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list From: Gavin Atkinson To: Peter Wemm In-Reply-To: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> References: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1072085630.23677.5.camel@buffy.york.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 09:33:50 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-York-MailScanner: Found to be clean cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 09:34:40 -0000 On Mon, 2003-12-22 at 00:16, Peter Wemm wrote: > Can > I get a quick ping from folks to let us know what they're willing to do > given the info above? I'm still happy to be involved and to help out. > Some of you told me you're near a computer all > day at work, or you work from home, etc. That and what kind of times > you're near a computer is the most useful to know. Don't feel > shy. :-) I'm usually in front of a computer most of the day at work (9am-5.30pm GMT), and more often than not I am online in the evenings (until, say, 9pm GMT). I'd be happy to cover whichever time is best. Gavin From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Dec 22 02:39:20 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C557616A4CE for ; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 02:39:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from taro.utanet.at (taro.utanet.at [213.90.36.45]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF10C43D39 for ; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 02:39:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from josef@daemon.li) Received: from patricia.utanet.at ([213.90.36.8]) by taro.utanet.at with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AYNT3-0008Ug-00; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 11:39:18 +0100 Received: from dsl-244-247.utaonline.at ([212.152.244.247] helo=jenny.daemon.li) by patricia.utanet.at with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AYNT3-0005u0-00; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 11:39:17 +0100 Received: by jenny.daemon.li (Postfix, from userid 1005) id 5E0EE66C; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 11:41:05 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 11:41:05 +0100 From: Josef El-Rayes To: Peter Wemm Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list Message-ID: <20031222104105.GA297@jenny.daemon.li> References: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Reply-Path: j.el-rayes@daemon.li X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.9-STABLE cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: j.el-rayes@daemon.li List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 10:39:20 -0000 Peter Wemm wrote: > Can > I get a quick ping from folks to let us know what they're willing to do > given the info above? hi, i am from austria (CET), as a student i have a lot of time sitting in front of computers, that means, usually i am here from 14-02. sorry for the delay, i went to bed just 5 minutes before your posting. greets, josef From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Dec 22 03:41:16 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 836B216A4CE for ; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 03:41:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from worf.kerna.com (worf.kerna.com [194.106.143.118]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id CC27943D39 for ; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 03:41:14 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from james@kerna.ie) Received: (qmail 63106 invoked by uid 1001); 22 Dec 2003 11:41:18 -0000 Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 11:41:18 +0000 From: James Raftery To: Peter Wemm Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list Message-ID: <20031222114118.GD61810@bender.kerna.ie> References: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 11:41:16 -0000 Hi, On Sun, Dec 21, 2003 at 04:16:17PM -0800, Peter Wemm wrote: > When a new message gets held for moderator attention, the list manager > sends an email to the moderator address. Once a day, it sends a "there > are 3 messages waiting moderator approval" if there are any that have > been sitting around for a while IMHO, the real-time messages are going to be unnecessary. I'd intend leaving a browser window open while I'm available to moderate and hit `reload' every so often to see what's new. It's no big deal though. > Can I get a quick ping from folks to let us know what they're willing to do > given the info above? Some of you told me you're near a computer all > day at work, or you work from home, etc. That and what kind of times > you're near a computer is the most useful to know. Don't feel > shy. :-) At a computer most days in work, 10:00 to 18:00 GMT (GMT+1 during Irish summer time) and check in once or twice most nights. For my crimes in a previous life, I used moderate a pretty heated discussion list for a CCLTD NIC. This is a bear pit I've been in before ;) ATB, james From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Dec 22 04:08:18 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9717A16A4CE for ; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 04:08:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp1.euronet.nl (smtp1.euronet.nl [194.134.35.133]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 34FDA43D1D for ; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 04:08:17 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dodell@sitetronics.com) Received: from [192.168.1.42] (zp-c-13e65.mxs.adsl.euronet.nl [81.69.92.101]) by smtp1.euronet.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9444671B5; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 13:08:13 +0100 (MET) In-Reply-To: <20031222114118.GD61810@bender.kerna.ie> References: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> <20031222114118.GD61810@bender.kerna.ie> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <8483E004-3477-11D8-9963-000A95E5E66E@sitetronics.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Devon H.O'Dell Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 13:08:13 +0100 To: James Raftery X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 12:08:18 -0000 > IMHO, the real-time messages are going to be unnecessary. I'd intend > leaving a browser window open while I'm available to moderate and > hit `reload' every so often to see what's new. It's no big deal though. If one wanted to get really sadistic, one could write a page that refreshes every so often. And beeps when something's new ;). I am in favor of the get-an-email-when-outstanding-emails-exist since I don't always have a browser window open. >> Can I get a quick ping from folks to let us know what they're willing >> to do >> given the info above? Some of you told me you're near a computer all >> day at work, or you work from home, etc. That and what kind of times >> you're near a computer is the most useful to know. Don't feel >> shy. :-) I'm near a computer about 24/7. I'm always on call and make 17 - 19 hour days (somewhat regularly :\). Generally speaking, I'm by a computer with my attention at least semi-geared toward the computer from 6 - 10PM GMT+1 and totally geared toward the computer from 8:30AM to 5PM GMT+1. Sometimes I do the 24/48 hour thing, but that's usually only once every 1 or 2 months. FWIW, I've never moderated a list before -- the closest I've ever come is having channel operator privileges in some (rather large) IRC channels. I tend to be able to keep my cool, especially about all things Internet-related. Anyway, I don't want this to end up sounding too much like a personal ad; feel free to ask me any questions as you have them. In response to ``...while others said 'I'll help if nobody else is willing...'' -- my response may have come across that way; however, I'm very interested in helping; I just thought it might be nice for people who aren't contributing in other ways to be given priority :). Good luck with the recruitment process! Kind regards, Devon H. O'Dell From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Dec 22 15:22:51 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C8BB16A4CE for ; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 15:22:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from customer.ecore.net (enterprise.ecore.net [212.223.99.1]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 240EE43D49 for ; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 15:22:49 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from cs@cheasy.de) Received: (qmail 13869 invoked from network); 22 Dec 2003 23:22:44 -0000 Received: from p50840c6d.dip0.t-ipconnect.de (HELO kiste) (80.132.12.109) by cheasy.de with SMTP; 22 Dec 2003 23:22:44 -0000 From: Christoph Sold To: Peter Wemm , mod-avail@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [mod-avail]Re: Welcome to the "mod-avail" mailing list Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 00:22:07 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> In-Reply-To: <200312211616.17262.peter@wemm.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200312230022.07259.cs@cheasy.de> X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 23:22:51 -0000 On Monday 22 December 2003 01:16, Peter Wemm wrote: > Again, I'm sorry for dropping you all in the deep end like this. > Here's the situation as best as I can describe. No need to apologize. Anything I can do to help? > [snip] > > It seems we have a very good spread of people from around the world > from different timezones. I know a couple of people said 'I really > want to do this' while others said 'I'll help if nobody else is > willing'. Can I get a quick ping from folks to let us know what > they're willing to do given the info above? Some of you told me > you're near a computer all day at work, or you work from home, etc. > That and what kind of times you're near a computer is the most useful > to know. Don't feel shy. :-) Ah. Ping! Available in CET/CEST (as in Berlin, Paris, Rome) weekdays in the evening, weekends varies. I'm following -current on daily basis. -- Christoph Sold, http://www.cheasy.de/ From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Dec 22 19:54:04 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5BA4116A54C for ; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 19:54:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from nox.cx (nox.cx [216.12.18.14]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4386B43D46 for ; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 19:54:03 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from zakj-freebsd-mod@nox.cx) Received: (qmail 33301 invoked by uid 1000); 23 Dec 2003 03:54:24 -0000 Message-ID: <20031223035424.33300.qmail@nox.cx> Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 22:54:24 -0500 From: Zak Johnson To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Mail-Followup-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Subject: [mod-avail] Schedule summary X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 03:54:05 -0000 It sounds as though everyone has posted their schedule now. I've tried to convert everyone to UTC and sort into a few groups based on where they stated a preference; for lack of a better plan, perhaps these groups could organize and sort out responsibilities amongst themselves? The times are completely arbitrary, and some people overlapped multiple groups. Forgive me if I'm stepping on any toes; I just wanted to help get the ball rolling. 0000 - 0800 UTC Scott Likens Daniel O'Connor Ryan Sommers Kent Stewart 0800 - 1600 UTC Gavin Atkinson Josef El-Rayes Dan Langille Erwin Lansing Devon O'Dell Josh Paetzel James Raftery Matthew Seaman Florian Smeets Kent Stewart 1600 - 2400 UTC Josef El-Rayes Zak Johnson Dan Langille Josh Paetzel Cristoph Sold Ryan Sommers Kent Stewart -Zak From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Dec 22 20:56:51 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA35E16A4CE for ; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 20:56:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from ns1.tcbug.org (12-218-40-24.client.mchsi.com [12.218.40.24]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD19343D39 for ; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 20:56:50 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from friar_josh@ns1.tcbug.org) Received: by ns1.tcbug.org (Postfix, from userid 1003) id B5123BA66; Mon, 22 Dec 2003 22:56:21 +0000 (GMT) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 22:56:20 +0000 From: Josh Paetzel To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [mod-avail] Schedule summary Message-ID: <20031222225619.GG32419@ns1.tcbug.org> References: <20031223035424.33300.qmail@nox.cx> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20031223035424.33300.qmail@nox.cx> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 04:56:51 -0000 On Mon, Dec 22, 2003 at 10:54:24PM -0500, Zak Johnson wrote: > It sounds as though everyone has posted their schedule now. I've tried > to convert everyone to UTC and sort into a few groups based on where > they stated a preference; for lack of a better plan, perhaps these > groups could organize and sort out responsibilities amongst themselves? > The times are completely arbitrary, and some people overlapped multiple > groups. Forgive me if I'm stepping on any toes; I just wanted to help > get the ball rolling. > > 0000 - 0800 UTC > Scott Likens > Daniel O'Connor > Ryan Sommers > Kent Stewart > > 0800 - 1600 UTC > Gavin Atkinson > Josef El-Rayes > Dan Langille > Erwin Lansing > Devon O'Dell > Josh Paetzel > James Raftery > Matthew Seaman > Florian Smeets > Kent Stewart > > 1600 - 2400 UTC > Josef El-Rayes > Zak Johnson > Dan Langille > Josh Paetzel > Cristoph Sold > Ryan Sommers > Kent Stewart > > -Zak This is starting to look more and more like we need to draw straws. ;) Josh Paetzel From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Dec 23 05:02:58 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9317416A4CE for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 05:02:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from bast.unixathome.org (bast.unixathome.org [66.11.174.150]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B14943D54 for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 05:02:57 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dan@langille.org) Received: from wocker (wocker.unixathome.org [192.168.0.99]) by bast.unixathome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 774763D28; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 08:02:56 -0500 (EST) From: "Dan Langille" To: Josh Paetzel Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 08:02:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [mod-avail] Schedule summary Message-ID: <3FE7F6B0.29782.A9ECB268@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <20031222225619.GG32419@ns1.tcbug.org> References: <20031223035424.33300.qmail@nox.cx> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 13:02:58 -0000 On 22 Dec 2003 at 22:56, Josh Paetzel wrote: > On Mon, Dec 22, 2003 at 10:54:24PM -0500, Zak Johnson wrote: > > It sounds as though everyone has posted their schedule now. I've > > tried to convert everyone to UTC and sort into a few groups based on > > where they stated a preference; for lack of a better plan, perhaps > > these groups could organize and sort out responsibilities amongst > > themselves? The times are completely arbitrary, and some people > > overlapped multiple groups. Forgive me if I'm stepping on any toes; > > I just wanted to help get the ball rolling. No toes that I see. > > 0000 - 0800 UTC > > Scott Likens > > Daniel O'Connor > > Ryan Sommers > > Kent Stewart > > > > 0800 - 1600 UTC > > Gavin Atkinson > > Josef El-Rayes > > Dan Langille > > Erwin Lansing > > Devon O'Dell > > Josh Paetzel > > James Raftery > > Matthew Seaman > > Florian Smeets > > Kent Stewart > > > > 1600 - 2400 UTC > > Josef El-Rayes > > Zak Johnson > > Dan Langille > > Josh Paetzel > > Cristoph Sold > > Ryan Sommers > > Kent Stewart > > > > -Zak > > This is starting to look more and more like we need to draw straws. ;) Straws for what? AFAIK, not everyone will be available all the time. Overlap is good. It reduces the workload for everyone. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Dec 23 05:26:39 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0027216A4CE for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 05:26:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp3.euronet.nl (smtp3.euronet.nl [194.134.35.173]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C055F43D1D for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 05:26:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dodell@sitetronics.com) Received: from [192.168.1.42] (zp-c-13e65.mxs.adsl.euronet.nl [81.69.92.101]) by smtp3.euronet.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86D2B3A070; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 14:26:34 +0100 (MET) In-Reply-To: <3FE7F6B0.29782.A9ECB268@localhost> References: <20031223035424.33300.qmail@nox.cx> <3FE7F6B0.29782.A9ECB268@localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Devon H.O'Dell Subject: Re: [mod-avail] Schedule summary Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 14:26:33 +0100 To: "Dan Langille" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 13:26:39 -0000 >>> I'm usually open 0700 - 2200 UTC. And sometimes to 2400... so I might fall into all three groups. I am definitely most active between 0800 and 1600 UTC, but I think I at least fall into the third as well. >> This is starting to look more and more like we need to draw straws. ;) > > Straws for what? AFAIK, not everyone will be available all the time. > Overlap is good. It reduces the workload for everyone. Well perhaps so, but there's also inherent confusion in systems where a ton of people are working on the same stuff at the same time. Specifically, do we really need ten people working from 0800 to 1600 UTC? This seems like it can get confusing and frustrating, especially if ten people are being emailed with ``Go moderate a few spam posts'', all ten go look, and the first one has already gotten it taken care of. I totally agree that overlap is good, but I also think that working on this type of project with ten people could get a good bit confusing :). (I think that the seven that fall into the last category would also experience these problems). Don't get me wrong: I hope that everybody can contribute -- I just hope that it doesn't get too confusing in the process :) I suppose the ball is now in the moderators' court, so-to-speak :). Kind regards, Devon H. O'Dell From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Dec 23 05:34:50 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BCA7716A4CE for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 05:34:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from daemon.li (daemon.li [213.203.244.86]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B1ABC43D48 for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 05:34:49 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from josef@daemon.li) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (uid 1000) by daemon.li with local; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 13:34:50 +0000 Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 13:34:50 +0000 From: Josef El-Rayes To: "Devon H.O'Dell" Subject: Re: [mod-avail] Schedule summary Message-ID: <20031223133450.GA13933@daemon.li> References: <20031223035424.33300.qmail@nox.cx> <3FE7F6B0.29782.A9ECB268@localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i Reply-Path: j.el-rayes@daemon.li cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: j.el-rayes@daemon.li List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 13:34:50 -0000 "Devon H.O'Dell" wrote: > I totally agree that overlap is good, but I also think > that working on this type of project with ten people > could get a good bit confusing :) we can split the groups in people responsible for the -current and -hackers mailing list. -josef From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Dec 23 05:39:38 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8266416A4CE for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 05:39:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp3.euronet.nl (smtp3.euronet.nl [194.134.35.173]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A3F9A43D2F for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 05:39:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dodell@sitetronics.com) Received: from [192.168.1.42] (zp-c-13e65.mxs.adsl.euronet.nl [81.69.92.101]) by smtp3.euronet.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2AFE3A078; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 14:39:36 +0100 (MET) In-Reply-To: <20031223133450.GA13933@daemon.li> References: <20031223035424.33300.qmail@nox.cx> <3FE7F6B0.29782.A9ECB268@localhost> <20031223133450.GA13933@daemon.li> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <72D8C85A-354D-11D8-80E0-000A95E5E66E@sitetronics.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Devon H.O'Dell Subject: Re: [mod-avail] Schedule summary Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 14:39:36 +0100 To: j.el-rayes@daemon.li X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 13:39:38 -0000 > we can split the groups in people responsible for the -current > and -hackers mailing list. > > -josef That sounds like a pretty good idea to me; should this list be too long, this idea gets my vote :) --Devon From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Dec 23 07:28:04 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDD6416A4CE for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 07:28:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk (happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk [81.2.69.218]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 491B043D50 for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 07:27:57 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from m.seaman@infracaninophile.co.uk) Received: from happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk (localhost [127.0.0.1]) hBNFRoWP036887 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 23 Dec 2003 15:27:50 GMT (envelope-from matthew@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk) Received: (from matthew@localhost)id hBNFRoYM036886; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 15:27:50 GMT (envelope-from matthew) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 15:27:50 +0000 From: Matthew Seaman To: Josh Paetzel Subject: Re: [mod-avail] Schedule summary Message-ID: <20031223152750.GA36128@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> Mail-Followup-To: Josh Paetzel , mod-avail@freebsd.org References: <20031223035424.33300.qmail@nox.cx> <20031222225619.GG32419@ns1.tcbug.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="LQksG6bCIzRHxTLp" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20031222225619.GG32419@ns1.tcbug.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.5.1i X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.9 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=2.61 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.61 (1.212.2.1-2003-12-09-exp) on happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 15:28:04 -0000 --LQksG6bCIzRHxTLp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, Dec 22, 2003 at 10:56:20PM +0000, Josh Paetzel wrote: > On Mon, Dec 22, 2003 at 10:54:24PM -0500, Zak Johnson wrote: > > It sounds as though everyone has posted their schedule now. I've tried > > to convert everyone to UTC and sort into a few groups based on where > > they stated a preference; for lack of a better plan, perhaps these > > groups could organize and sort out responsibilities amongst themselves? > > The times are completely arbitrary, and some people overlapped multiple > > groups. Forgive me if I'm stepping on any toes; I just wanted to help > > get the ball rolling. > >=20 > > 0000 - 0800 UTC > > Scott Likens > > Daniel O'Connor > > Ryan Sommers > > Kent Stewart > >=20 > > 0800 - 1600 UTC > > Gavin Atkinson > > Josef El-Rayes > > Dan Langille > > Erwin Lansing > > Devon O'Dell > > Josh Paetzel > > James Raftery > > Matthew Seaman > > Florian Smeets > > Kent Stewart > >=20 > > 1600 - 2400 UTC > > Josef El-Rayes > > Zak Johnson > > Dan Langille > > Josh Paetzel > > Cristoph Sold > > Ryan Sommers > > Kent Stewart > >=20 > > -Zak >=20 > This is starting to look more and more like we need to draw straws. ;) Hmmm... As I understand Peter's intention, there should be two people "on duty" at any time to handle anything that comes up (ie. one for hackers@... and one for current@...). Perhaps instead of three 8 hour timeslots, there should be eight 3 hour or twelve 2 hour timeslots in every 24h. Plus some sort of website where people can book rota slots[*]. Duty person promises to be at their computer or nearby during the specified time, preferably with a browser window open onto the moderation screen for the list they're covering. Anyone have any suggestion as to when exactly we start really doing this rather than just talking about it? =20 Cheers, Matthew [*] I feel some perl coming on.... Let me sketch something out so you can see exactly what I mean. --=20 Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil. 26 The Paddocks Savill Way PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Marlow Tel: +44 1628 476614 Bucks., SL7 1TH UK --LQksG6bCIzRHxTLp Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQE/6F72dtESqEQa7a0RAlQ/AJoCruo3yMDrIL1BccJhVCg11rN7LACdH8Di uuncgV7oT0ZmGnjZL2s1ZD4= =nOmd -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --LQksG6bCIzRHxTLp-- From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Dec 23 07:46:26 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 677BE16A4CE for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 07:46:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from daemon.li (daemon.li [213.203.244.86]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 15BCF43D31 for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 07:46:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from josef@daemon.li) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (uid 1000) by daemon.li with local; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 15:46:25 +0000 Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 15:46:24 +0000 From: josef@daemon.li To: Josh Paetzel , mod-avail@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [mod-avail] Schedule summary Message-ID: <20031223154624.GA14083@daemon.li> References: <20031223035424.33300.qmail@nox.cx> <20031222225619.GG32419@ns1.tcbug.org> <20031223152750.GA36128@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20031223152750.GA36128@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i Reply-Path: j.el-rayes@daemon.li X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: j.el-rayes@daemon.li List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 15:46:26 -0000 Matthew Seaman wrote: > On Mon, Dec 22, 2003 at 10:56:20PM +0000, Josh Paetzel wrote: > > On Mon, Dec 22, 2003 at 10:54:24PM -0500, Zak Johnson wrote: > Hmmm... As I understand Peter's intention, there should be two people > "on duty" at any time to handle anything that comes up (ie. one for > hackers@... and one for current@...). Perhaps instead of three 8 hour > timeslots, there should be eight 3 hour or twelve 2 hour timeslots in > every 24h. why so complicated? why not just handle it like problem reports: 1) mail to handle comes in via mailinglist 2) moderator joe thinks this one should get an action 3) he sends a quick note to the moderators mailinglist "i will handle this" 4) moderator paul sees mail too, sees joes note, knows that this is already getting handled. this should be enough to help us synchronizing our threads :) greets, josef From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Dec 23 07:50:43 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83E7016A4CE for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 07:50:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from mhub-m6.tc.umn.edu (mhub-m6.tc.umn.edu [160.94.23.36]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5ADD843D2F for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 07:50:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ryans@gamersimpact.com) Received: from [24.107.70.120] by mhub-m6.tc.umn.edu with ESMTP; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 09:50:38 -0600 Subject: Re: [mod-avail] Schedule summary From: Ryan Sommers To: Matthew Seaman In-Reply-To: <20031223152750.GA36128@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> References: <20031223035424.33300.qmail@nox.cx> <20031222225619.GG32419@ns1.tcbug.org> <20031223152750.GA36128@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1072194432.817.2.camel@localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 09:47:12 -0600 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 15:50:43 -0000 > Hmmm... As I understand Peter's intention, there should be two people > "on duty" at any time to handle anything that comes up (ie. one for > hackers@... and one for current@...). Perhaps instead of three 8 hour > timeslots, there should be eight 3 hour or twelve 2 hour timeslots in > every 24h. Plus some sort of website where people can book rota > slots[*]. Duty person promises to be at their computer or nearby > during the specified time, preferably with a browser window open onto > the moderation screen for the list they're covering. I think this is turning too much into a bikeshed and people are trying to refine something before it is in place. I really believe in the KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid) philosophy and think we need to go with the simplest solution for now. Later we can critique that to death and then refine and complicate it. -- Ryan "leadZERO" Sommers ryans@gamersimpact.com From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Dec 23 07:57:35 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2005316A4CE for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 07:57:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp0.euronet.nl (smtp0.euronet.nl [194.134.35.141]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D16F943D4C for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 07:57:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dodell@sitetronics.com) Received: from [192.168.1.42] (zp-c-13e65.mxs.adsl.euronet.nl [81.69.92.101]) by smtp0.euronet.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id C32132463C; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 16:57:29 +0100 (MET) In-Reply-To: <20031223154624.GA14083@daemon.li> References: <20031223035424.33300.qmail@nox.cx> <20031222225619.GG32419@ns1.tcbug.org> <20031223152750.GA36128@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> <20031223154624.GA14083@daemon.li> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Devon H.O'Dell Subject: Re: [mod-avail] Schedule summary Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 16:57:30 +0100 To: j.el-rayes@daemon.li X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 15:57:35 -0000 > why so complicated? why not just handle it like problem reports: > > 1) mail to handle comes in via mailinglist > 2) moderator joe thinks this one should get an action > 3) he sends a quick note to the moderators mailinglist "i will handle > this" > 4) moderator paul sees mail too, sees joes note, knows that this is > already > getting handled. > > this should be enough to help us synchronizing our threads :) > > greets, josef I have my email sync every minute, but I know not everybody does this. Even so, it will take up to 2 minutes before Paul sees the email that Joe sent the moderator list. Additionally, sometimes people experience ``latency'' with the lists. I agree with a KISS approach, although I also think that we should either follow Josef's suggestion of splitting the work into W & X handle current@ and Y & Z handle hackers@ _or_ Matthew's suggestion of shorter ``shifts.'' I think that the reason for the bikeshedding is because of the fact that there are a lot of people who want to help. I think the real solution is to either eliminate this being a problem (per Josef and/or Matthew's suggestions) or to eliminate this problem (i.e. drawing straws). I think the way the moderation works (as I understand it) is fine how it is; we need to figure out a way to split the force. And there have been two great suggestions thus far. Any input from Peter on this would definitely be good input at this point :). Kind regards, Devon H. O'Dell From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Dec 23 08:20:58 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7046716A4CE for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 08:20:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from gina.daemon.li (dsl-20-183.utaonline.at [81.189.20.183]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7554643D49 for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 08:20:54 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from josef@gina.daemon.li) Received: from gina.daemon.li (localhost.daemon.li [127.0.0.1]) by gina.daemon.li (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id hBNGKeJ5000496; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 17:20:43 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from josef@gina.daemon.li) Received: (from josef@localhost) by gina.daemon.li (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id hBNFh5vQ000721; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 16:43:05 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from josef) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 16:43:05 +0100 From: Josef El-Rayes To: Josh Paetzel , mod-avail@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [mod-avail] Schedule summary Message-ID: <20031223154305.GA84139@gina.daemon.li> References: <20031223035424.33300.qmail@nox.cx> <20031222225619.GG32419@ns1.tcbug.org> <20031223152750.GA36128@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20031223152750.GA36128@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Reply-Path: j.el-rayes@daemon.li X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 5.2-RC1 X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: j.el-rayes@daemon.li List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 16:20:58 -0000 Matthew Seaman wrote: > On Mon, Dec 22, 2003 at 10:56:20PM +0000, Josh Paetzel wrote: > > On Mon, Dec 22, 2003 at 10:54:24PM -0500, Zak Johnson wrote: > Hmmm... As I understand Peter's intention, there should be two people > "on duty" at any time to handle anything that comes up (ie. one for > hackers@... and one for current@...). Perhaps instead of three 8 hour > timeslots, there should be eight 3 hour or twelve 2 hour timeslots in > every 24h. why so complicated? why not just handle it like problem reports: 1) mail to handle comes in via mailinglist 2) moderator joe thinks this one should get an action 3) he sends a quick note to the moderators mailinglist "i will handle this" 4) moderator paul sees mail too, sees joes note, knows that this is already getting handled. this should be enough to help us synchronizing our threads :) greets, josef From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Dec 23 08:55:48 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1168416A4D8 for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 08:55:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from bast.unixathome.org (bast.unixathome.org [66.11.174.150]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B63B43D2F for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 08:55:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dan@langille.org) Received: from wocker (wocker.unixathome.org [192.168.0.99]) by bast.unixathome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72CC63D28; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 11:55:43 -0500 (EST) From: "Dan Langille" To: Devon H.O'Dell Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 11:55:43 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [mod-avail] Schedule summary Message-ID: <3FE82D3F.2636.AAC1D53D@localhost> Priority: normal References: <20031223154624.GA14083@daemon.li> In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 16:55:48 -0000 On 23 Dec 2003 at 16:57, Devon H.O'Dell wrote: > I have my email sync every minute, but I know not everybody > does this. Even so, it will take up to 2 minutes before Paul sees the > email that Joe sent the moderator list. Additionally, sometimes people > experience ``latency'' with the lists. I see no problem with mail lag. You see a post, you go, if nothing there to do, no worries. > I agree with a KISS approach, although I also think that we should > either follow Josef's suggestion of splitting the work into W & X > handle current@ and Y & Z handle hackers@ _or_ Matthew's suggestion of > shorter ``shifts.'' I see no reason to split anything. Sometimes people are available. Sometime they are not. Let's not roster people. The reason for the list presented earlier, IMHO, was to show that we do have time periods covered. Not everyone will be available at all times during their respective claimed "available" periods. Overlap is good. > I think that the reason for the bikeshedding is because of the fact > that there are a lot of people who want to help. I think the real > solution is to either eliminate this being a problem (per Josef and/or > Matthew's suggestions) or to eliminate this problem (i.e. drawing > straws). I don't see the number of helpers as a problem. I see it as a solution. Let's start doing the job and see how it goes instead of solving problems we don't [yet or might never] have. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Dec 23 10:14:50 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C98416A4CE for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 10:14:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk (ns0.infracaninophile.co.uk [81.2.69.218]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58E1E43D46 for ; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 10:14:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from m.seaman@infracaninophile.co.uk) Received: from happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk (localhost [127.0.0.1]) hBNIEbWP038576 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 23 Dec 2003 18:14:37 GMT (envelope-from matthew@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk) Received: (from matthew@localhost)id hBNIEbDs038575; Tue, 23 Dec 2003 18:14:37 GMT (envelope-from matthew) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 18:14:37 +0000 From: Matthew Seaman To: Ryan Sommers Subject: Re: [mod-avail] Schedule summary Message-ID: <20031223181437.GA38276@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> Mail-Followup-To: Ryan Sommers , Josh Paetzel , mod-avail@freebsd.org References: <20031223035424.33300.qmail@nox.cx> <20031222225619.GG32419@ns1.tcbug.org> <20031223152750.GA36128@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> <1072194432.817.2.camel@localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="envbJBWh7q8WU6mo" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <1072194432.817.2.camel@localhost> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.5.1i X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.9 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=2.61 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.61 (1.212.2.1-2003-12-09-exp) on happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2003 18:14:50 -0000 --envbJBWh7q8WU6mo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, Dec 23, 2003 at 09:47:12AM -0600, Ryan Sommers wrote: > > Hmmm... As I understand Peter's intention, there should be two people > > "on duty" at any time to handle anything that comes up (ie. one for > > hackers@... and one for current@...). Perhaps instead of three 8 hour > > timeslots, there should be eight 3 hour or twelve 2 hour timeslots in > > every 24h. Plus some sort of website where people can book rota > > slots[*]. Duty person promises to be at their computer or nearby > > during the specified time, preferably with a browser window open onto > > the moderation screen for the list they're covering. >=20 > I think this is turning too much into a bikeshed and people are trying > to refine something before it is in place. I really believe in the KISS > (Keep It Simple Stupid) philosophy and think we need to go with the > simplest solution for now. Later we can critique that to death and then > refine and complicate it. Actually, I've changed my mind. On condsidering the arguments in this thread I'm convinced by Ryan and others who have said similar to the above. I retract my proposal (for the time being). The KISS way is good, at least initially. However, after a month or two when the novelty has worn off and people are starting to get bored with the whole thing, and possibly if the scheme gets extended to more than just the two lists, a more organized approach would be beneficial. Cheers, Matthew --=20 Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil. 26 The Paddocks Savill Way PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Marlow Tel: +44 1628 476614 Bucks., SL7 1TH UK --envbJBWh7q8WU6mo Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQE/6IYNdtESqEQa7a0RAo7rAJ9+3pdS/ogsy9F5eWOdWJgVMQSxMACeLtJK AswEFDrmcwOZMkxtOAHGPos= =rXSs -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --envbJBWh7q8WU6mo-- From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Dec 26 17:18:14 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8D8D16A4CE for ; Fri, 26 Dec 2003 17:18:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from paladincorp.com.au (c211-30-138-242.blktn1.nsw.optusnet.com.au [211.30.138.242]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E83EE43D45 for ; Fri, 26 Dec 2003 17:18:12 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from torquemada@paladincorp.com.au) Received: from rameau.paladincorp.com.au (rameau.paladincorp.com.au [192.168.0.50]) by paladincorp.com.au (8.12.9p1/8.12.10) with ESMTP id hBR1I0sh037639 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=NO) for ; Sat, 27 Dec 2003 12:18:00 +1100 (EST) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2003 12:17:47 +1100 (AUS Eastern Daylight Time) From: Torquemada To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [mod-avail] Schedule summary In-Reply-To: <20031223035424.33300.qmail@nox.cx> Message-ID: References: <20031223035424.33300.qmail@nox.cx> X-X-Sender: norman@chopin.paladincorp.com.au MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Copied-To: backup@paladincorp.com.au (by Synonym - http://www.modulo.ro/synonym) X-Scanned-By: milter-spamc/0.9.102 (chopin.paladincorp.com.au [192.168.0.5]); Sat, 27 Dec 2003 12:18:01 +1100 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Status: NO, hits=1.10 required=5.00 X-Spam-Level: x X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2003 01:18:14 -0000 Sorry for not answering until now, just been following the thread and wondering how many excellent offers of assistance there were. I'm online pretty much 24/7 working from a home-office 7 days a week. kind regards Torquemada On Mon, 22 Dec 2003, Zak Johnson wrote: > to convert everyone to UTC and sort into a few groups based on where > they stated a preference; for lack of a better plan, perhaps these > groups could organize and sort out responsibilities amongst themselves? > The times are completely arbitrary, and some people overlapped multiple > groups. Forgive me if I'm stepping on any toes; I just wanted to help > get the ball rolling. > From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Dec 26 22:38:41 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4AF3916A4CE for ; Fri, 26 Dec 2003 22:38:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from desolation.livid.de (portal.aphroland.org [216.39.174.24]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7781243D2F for ; Fri, 26 Dec 2003 22:38:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from damm@yazzy.org) Received: by desolation.livid.de (Postfix, from userid 500) id 4BA9E8F7E51; Fri, 26 Dec 2003 22:37:58 -0800 (PST) From: Scott Likens To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <1072507077.27597.0.camel@desolation.livid.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2003 22:37:58 -0800 Subject: [mod-avail] ... X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2003 06:38:41 -0000 I'm gonna actually be moving in a bit, so i'm gonna resign from the list. Thanks for the thoughts. Scott From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Jan 2 05:03:55 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E10CC16A4CE for ; Fri, 2 Jan 2004 05:03:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk (smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk [81.2.69.218]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3EA1443D53 for ; Fri, 2 Jan 2004 05:03:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from m.seaman@infracaninophile.co.uk) Received: from happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk (localhost [127.0.0.1]) i02D3mwd029121 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 2 Jan 2004 13:03:48 GMT (envelope-from matthew@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk) Received: (from matthew@localhost)id i02D3ms2029120 for mod-avail@freebsd.org; Fri, 2 Jan 2004 13:03:48 GMT (envelope-from matthew) Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2004 13:03:48 +0000 From: Matthew Seaman To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [mod-avail] Schedule summary Message-ID: <20040102130348.GA28851@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> Mail-Followup-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org References: <20031223035424.33300.qmail@nox.cx> <20031222225619.GG32419@ns1.tcbug.org> <20031223152750.GA36128@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="azLHFNyN32YCQGCU" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20031223152750.GA36128@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.5.1i X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.9 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=2.61 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.61 (1.212.2.1-2003-12-09-exp) on happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 02 Jan 2004 13:03:56 -0000 --azLHFNyN32YCQGCU Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, Dec 23, 2003 at 03:27:50PM +0000, Matthew Seaman wrote: > [*] I feel some perl coming on.... Let me sketch something out so you > can see exactly what I mean. Ho hum. For what it's worth, I seem to have got my scripts into something like working order. You can give it a whirl at: http://mod-avail.infracaninophile.co.uk/ For which you will need a login. I've set up some sample logins: Username Password aragorn@dunedain.org aragorn boromir@gondor.com boromir frodo.baggins@shire.org frodo gandalf@istari.org gandalf gimli@lonely-mountain.com gimli legolas@mirkwood.com legolas meriadoc.brandybuck@shire.org merry peregrine.took@shire.org pippin sam.gamgee@shire.org sam It's not on a hugely fast connection. The script and some supporting stuff is available at http://mod-avail.infracaninophile.co.uk/mod-avail-0.1.tgz Cheers, Matthew --=20 Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil. 26 The Paddocks Savill Way PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Marlow Tel: +44 1628 476614 Bucks., SL7 1TH UK --azLHFNyN32YCQGCU Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQE/9Ww0dtESqEQa7a0RAtuuAJ9BkGu3FuUM9UczVL7j/eLjWkN5BACdEnUR 0nL9stdWfmAXTtMFOcOuM24= =Wyhw -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --azLHFNyN32YCQGCU-- From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Jan 2 07:08:55 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DAD4616A4CE for ; Fri, 2 Jan 2004 07:08:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from customer.ecore.net (enterprise.ecore.net [212.223.99.1]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 253BD43D2D for ; Fri, 2 Jan 2004 07:08:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from cs@cheasy.de) Received: (qmail 20813 invoked from network); 2 Jan 2004 15:08:50 -0000 Received: from p5084074e.dip0.t-ipconnect.de (HELO kiste) (80.132.7.78) by cheasy.de with SMTP; 2 Jan 2004 15:08:50 -0000 From: Christoph Sold To: Matthew Seaman Subject: Re: [mod-avail] Schedule summary Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2004 16:07:46 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <20031223035424.33300.qmail@nox.cx> <20031223152750.GA36128@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> <20040102130348.GA28851@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <20040102130348.GA28851@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200401021607.46465.cs@cheasy.de> cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 02 Jan 2004 15:08:56 -0000 On Friday 02 January 2004 14:03, Matthew Seaman wrote: > On Tue, Dec 23, 2003 at 03:27:50PM +0000, Matthew Seaman wrote: > > [*] I feel some perl coming on.... Let me sketch something out so > > you can see exactly what I mean. > > Ho hum. For what it's worth, I seem to have got my scripts into > something like working order. You can give it a whirl at: > > http://mod-avail.infracaninophile.co.uk/ > > For which you will need a login. =20 Works for me. I like the interface pretty much. Anything I can do to help? =2DChristoph Sold =2D- Christoph Sold, D=F6rrhorst-Stra=DFe 23, D-67059 Ludwigshafen (Rhein) mod-avail@cheasy.de, Tel: +49-621-5723206, Mobile: +49-174-5862882 From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Jan 2 07:08:56 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDF4716A4CF for ; Fri, 2 Jan 2004 07:08:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from customer.ecore.net (enterprise.ecore.net [212.223.99.1]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 2551543D39 for ; Fri, 2 Jan 2004 07:08:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from cs@cheasy.de) Received: (qmail 20808 invoked from network); 2 Jan 2004 15:08:49 -0000 Received: from p5084074e.dip0.t-ipconnect.de (HELO kiste) (80.132.7.78) by cheasy.de with SMTP; 2 Jan 2004 15:08:49 -0000 From: Christoph Sold To: Matthew Seaman Subject: [mod-avail] Re: Schedule summary Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2004 16:04:27 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <20031223035424.33300.qmail@nox.cx> <20031223152750.GA36128@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> <20040102130348.GA28851@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <20040102130348.GA28851@happy-idiot-talk.infracaninophile.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200401021604.27394.cs@cheasy.de> cc: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 02 Jan 2004 15:08:56 -0000 On Friday 02 January 2004 14:03, Matthew Seaman wrote: > On Tue, Dec 23, 2003 at 03:27:50PM +0000, Matthew Seaman wrote: > > [*] I feel some perl coming on.... Let me sketch something out so > > you can see exactly what I mean. Works for me. Anything I can do to help? =2DChristoph Sold =2D- Christoph Sold, D=F6rrhorst-Str. 23, D-67059 Ludwigshafen (Rhein) cs@cheasy.de, Phone: +49-621-5723206, Mobile: +49-174-5862882 From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Nov 21 16:39:43 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD05316A41F for ; Mon, 21 Nov 2005 16:39:43 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from fgEHCBP@i5net.net) Received: from 158.Red-83-45-226.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net (158.Red-83-45-226.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net [83.45.226.158]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id D95D343D72 for ; Mon, 21 Nov 2005 16:39:41 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from fgEHCBP@i5net.net) Message-ID: <0009$021bc2ab$033d5ddb@konqueror> Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2005 16:39:42 +0000 From: "Rita Yang" To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [mod-avail] Re[3]: X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2005 16:39:44 -0000 New offering get it while it is fresh JC Data Solutions OTC: JCDS Price: .085 If It Went to .25, Would You Be Happy? Big PR UnderWay. Will it Explode Higher? Like Many of These Small Ones,If and When They Take Off Sometimes, They Really Go. You Know What To Do If You Think So. About JC Data Solutions (Source: News 11/11/05) JC Data Solutions provides comprehensive, innovative and cost-effective solutions for digital document processing and management. JC Data Solutions puts client documents in digital formats that are inexpensive to store, simple to backup and archive, and easy to retrieve in a fraction of the time required for paper documents. JC Data Solutions proprietary software solutions are targeted to the legal, health care, manufacturing, distribution and document storage sectors, target markets in the $500 million electronic document management market growing at 30% per year. JCDS trains and supports a unique nationwide network of resellers by geographic market to target small to medium clients. JCDS has a home office in Dallas, TX, technical support personnel in Erie, PA and satellite sales offices in, Houston, TX, Mobile, AL, and Hot Springs, AR. JCDS was founded in 1996, is an industry leader with a management team that has over 50 years of document solution experience. Go to Your Favorite Financial Website Now and Read The News Stories! _______________ Certain statements in this news release may contain forward-looking information within the meaning of Rule 175 under the Sec urities Act of 1933 and Rul e 3b-6 under the Sec urities Exc hange Act of 1934, and are subject to the s afe har bor created by those rules. All statements other than statements of fact, included in this release, are forw ard looki ng stat ements that involve ris ks and uncer tainties. Please be aware also that the Comp any is not a repor ting company regi stered under the Secur ities Exc hange A ct of 193 4 and there is li mited informat ion availab le about the comp any. As with many mic rocap sto cks, today's company has disc osable mater ial items you need to consider in order to make an informed and intelligent in_vestment decision. These items inc lude: no reve nue in its most rec ent quarter as it is a new corp oration. It is an operat ing Company. The company is going to need finan cing.If that finan cing does not occur, the company may not be able to con tinue as a going concern in which case you could lo se your entire in-ves tment. Other f actors include gene ral econ omic and busi ness condi tions, the abil ity to acqu ire and develop speci fic proj ects, the ability to fund opera tions and changes in cons umer and bu siness consum ption habits and other fac tors over which the com pany has li ttle or no con trol. The publ isher of this newsle tter does not repr esent that the inform ation conta ined in this me sage states all mate rial facts or does not omit a mat erial fact neces sary to make the statem ents therein not misle ading. All inform ation provided wi thin this e mail pertai ning to inves ting, st 0cks, securi ties must be underst ood as infor mation prov ided and not investm ent advi ce. Reme mber a thorough due diligenc e effort, including a review of a company's filings when available, should be completed prior to inve sting. The publisher of this newsletter advises all readers and subscribers to seek advice from a regi stered profes sional secu rities repres entative before deciding to t rade in st0 cks featu red wit hin this e mail. None of the mater ial wit hin this re port shall be const rued as any kind of inves tment advice or solicit ation. Many of these compan ies are on the verge of bank ruptcy. You can lose all your mo ney by inves ting in this st 0ck. The publi sher of th is newsle tter is not a regist ered in-v estment advi s0r. Subscr ibers shou ld not view info rmation her ein as le gal, t ax, account ing or in vestme nt advice. In compli ance wi th the Securit ies Act of 19 33, Sect ion 1 7( b),The pub lisher of this news letter is contra cted to receive f0 urty tho_us and d0l lars fr om a thi rd party, not an off icer, direc tor or affil ate shareho lder for the circula tion of this re port. Be a ware of an inh erent conf lict of int erest res ulting from such compe nsation due to the fa ct that th is is a pai d advertis ement and is not without bi as.The party that pays us has a pos ition in the st ock they will sell at any time wi thout notice. This could hav e a nega tive im pact on the pri ce of the st ock, caus ing you to lose mo ney.Their inten tion is to sell. All fa ctual info rmation in this rep ort was gath ered from public sou rces, inclu ding but not limit ed to Co mpany Press Rele ases. The publ isher of this news letter beli eves this info rmation to be rel iable but can make no guara ntee as to its accu racy or complet eness. Use of the material within this email consti tutes your accept ance of these terms. From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sun May 28 10:41:58 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55F7516B095 for ; Sun, 28 May 2006 10:36:54 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rpetyeznue@opbu.xerox.com) Received: from opbu.xerox.com (IGLD-84-228-232-178.inter.net.il [84.228.232.178]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 0B08743D5D for ; Sun, 28 May 2006 10:36:50 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from rpetyeznue@opbu.xerox.com) Received: from jq-jg01 (192.168.2.44) by smtp-s3.antel.net.uy (7.2.072.1) (authenticated as rpetyeznue@opbu.xerox.com) id cy3bc20c1ekzv2hv Sun, 28 May 2006 12:36:45 +0200 Received: from [84.228.232.178] by www.adinet.com.uy via http; Sun, 28 May 2006 12:36:45 +0200 Message-ID: <72631268.4935964725077.JavaMail.afcuzm@jq-jg01> Date: Sun, 28 May 2006 12:36:45 +0200 (UYT) From: "qlnrmli xynqhmniu" To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset="ISO-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Originating-IP: 84.228.232.178 Subject: [mod-avail] {Reply} the hidden gem CTXE X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: qlnrmli xynqhmniu List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 28 May 2006 10:42:02 -0000 CTXE***CTXE***CTXE***CTXE***CTXE***CTXE***CTXE Get CTXE First Thing Today, Check out for HOT NEWS!!! CTXE - CANTEX ENERGY CORP CURRENT_PRICE: $0.53 GET IT N0W! Before we start with the profile of CTXE we would like to mention something very important: There is a Big PR Campaign starting this weeek . And it will go all week so it would be best to get in NOW. Company Profile Cantex Energy Corporation is an independent, managed risk, oil and gas exploration, development, and production company headquartered in San Antonio, Texas. Recent News Cantex Energy Corp. Announces Completion of the GPS Survey Today and the Mobilization of Seismic Crews for Big Canyon 2D Swath, Management would like to report The GPS surveying of our Big Canyon 2D Swath Geophysical program is being completed today. The crew that has been obtained to conduct the seismic survey (Quantum Geophysical) will be mobilizing May 30 (plus or minus 2 days) to the Big Canyon Prospect. It will take the crews about 3 to 4 days to get all the equipment (cable and geophones) laid out on the ground and then another day of testing so we should be in full production mode on or around the 4th or 5th of June. Once the first of three lines are shot we will then get data processed and report progress on a weekly basis. Cantex Energy Corp. Receiving Interest From the Industry as It Enters Next Phase of Development Cantex Energy Corp. (CTXE - News) is pleased to report the following on its Big Canyon Prospect in West Texas. Recent company announcements related to the acquisition of over 48,000 acres of a world-class prospect has captured the attention of many oil & gas industry experts and corporations, who have recently inquired into various participation opportunities ranging from sharing science technology to support findings or expertise to drill, operate and manage wells. Trace Maurin, President of Cantex, commented, "Although we are a small independent oil & gas company, we have a very unique 0pp0rtunity in one of the last under-explored world-class potential gas plays with no geopolitical risks and the industry is starting to take notice. As we prepare to prove up the various structures within our prospect later this month, we are increasing our efforts to communicate on our progress to our shareholders and investors. Our intention is to provide investors with a better understanding of the full potential of this prospect as we embark on the next phase of operations." Starting immediately the company will undertake CEO interviews, radio spots (which will be recorded and published on the company website), publication placements, introductions to small cap institutional investors and funds all in an effort to optimize market awareness and keep our shareholder well informed. GET IN NOW Happy memorial day Water it down. Salt of the Earth. Rain, rain go away; come again some other day. Worked night and day. Tools of the trade. Spaceship earth. Up a tree. Scraping the bottom of the barrel. You reap what you sow. The way to a man's heart is through his stomach. The squeaky wheel gets the grease. You can't teach an old dog new tricks. To live from hand to mouth. A thorn in my side. Which came first, the chicken or the egg. Spill the beans. Raking in the dough. You throw filth on the living and flowers on the dead.Pin a rose on your nose. Rise and shine. Too little too late. You can't squeeze blood out of a turnip. Putting the cart before the horse. The sharper is the berry, the sweeter is the wine. Your all washed up. What goes up must come down. A stepping stone to. From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sun May 28 14:49:28 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE93316AA58 for ; Sun, 28 May 2006 14:49:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from norobn@ski.com) Received: from ski.com (enk66.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl [83.20.0.66]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id ED96E43D53 for ; Sun, 28 May 2006 14:49:26 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from norobn@ski.com) Received: from xj-yf02 (192.168.2.55) by smtp-s6.antel.net.uy (7.2.072.1) (authenticated as norobn@ski.com) id v9le1uv8x3ch3vpa Sun, 28 May 2006 16:49:17 +0100 Received: from [83.20.0.66] by www.adinet.com.uy via http; Sun, 28 May 2006 16:49:17 +0100 Message-ID: <91445034.2218262758745.JavaMail.zzjpoyby@xj-yf02> Date: Sun, 28 May 2006 16:49:17 +0100 (UYT) From: "cauyikoi lteumqh" To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset="ISO-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Originating-IP: 83.20.0.66 Subject: [mod-avail] {news} Emerging growth CTXE X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: cauyikoi lteumqh List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 28 May 2006 14:49:29 -0000 CTXE***CTXE***CTXE***CTXE***CTXE***CTXE***CTXE Get CTXE First Thing Today, Check out for HOT NEWS!!! CTXE - CANTEX ENERGY CORP CURRENT_PRICE: $0.53 GET IT N0W! Before we start with the profile of CTXE we would like to mention something very important: There is a Big PR Campaign starting this weeek . And it will go all week so it would be best to get in NOW. Company Profile Cantex Energy Corporation is an independent, managed risk, oil and gas exploration, development, and production company headquartered in San Antonio, Texas. Recent News Cantex Energy Corp. Announces Completion of the GPS Survey Today and the Mobilization of Seismic Crews for Big Canyon 2D Swath, Management would like to report The GPS surveying of our Big Canyon 2D Swath Geophysical program is being completed today. The crew that has been obtained to conduct the seismic survey (Quantum Geophysical) will be mobilizing May 30 (plus or minus 2 days) to the Big Canyon Prospect. It will take the crews about 3 to 4 days to get all the equipment (cable and geophones) laid out on the ground and then another day of testing so we should be in full production mode on or around the 4th or 5th of June. Once the first of three lines are shot we will then get data processed and report progress on a weekly basis. Cantex Energy Corp. Receiving Interest From the Industry as It Enters Next Phase of Development Cantex Energy Corp. (CTXE - News) is pleased to report the following on its Big Canyon Prospect in West Texas. Recent company announcements related to the acquisition of over 48,000 acres of a world-class prospect has captured the attention of many oil & gas industry experts and corporations, who have recently inquired into various participation opportunities ranging from sharing science technology to support findings or expertise to drill, operate and manage wells. Trace Maurin, President of Cantex, commented, "Although we are a small independent oil & gas company, we have a very unique 0pp0rtunity in one of the last under-explored world-class potential gas plays with no geopolitical risks and the industry is starting to take notice. As we prepare to prove up the various structures within our prospect later this month, we are increasing our efforts to communicate on our progress to our shareholders and investors. Our intention is to provide investors with a better understanding of the full potential of this prospect as we embark on the next phase of operations." Starting immediately the company will undertake CEO interviews, radio spots (which will be recorded and published on the company website), publication placements, introductions to small cap institutional investors and funds all in an effort to optimize market awareness and keep our shareholder well informed. GET IN NOW Happy memorial day To rule the mountains is to rule the river. Your barking up the wrong tree. There is always next year. Sly as a fox. This is for the birds. A thorn in my side. Spring forward fall back. She's the apple of my eye. Useless as tits on bull. Spaceship earth. The stronger the breeze the stronger the trees. Stop, look and listen. We'll cross that bridge when we come to it. That's a whole new can of worms. Rare as walking on water. To live from hand to mouth. Tastes like chicken. Spaceship earth. From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Aug 30 14:23:30 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FD3816A4F4; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 14:23:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from xaheifmu@inetia.pl) Received: from inetia.pl (87-205-88-98.adsl.inetia.pl [87.205.88.98]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 557E543DB1; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 14:23:11 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from xaheifmu@inetia.pl) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 16:23:11 +0100 From: "ketcguzf qropeza" X-Sender: xaheifmu@inetia.pl To: , , , Message-Id: <7343835532.hmRigt-09463058-7256@inetia.pl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Cc: Subject: [mod-avail] The Bull Market That Never Ends GDKI . pk X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 14:23:30 -0000 This is the best kept secret in entertainment Health Care Sector has been booming since decades, this is the next big one. Company Profile Goldmark Industries, specializes in the production and distribution of Music, Feature Fillms and Television entertainment for North America's most rapidly growing demographic, with a total consumer-based purchasing power of over 1 Trillion dollars: the Hip-Hop community. GOLDMARK INDUSTRIES (GDKI) CURRENT_PRICE: $ 4.60 GET IT NoW! 5 DAY expected : $ 7.90 Current News Goldmark Industries, Inc. (GDKI - News), a rising Urban Entertainment force, is pleased to announce that the Company has enhanced its Executive Leadership with the addition of accomplished artist, Frost, as Vice President of the Music Division. Frost is very well respected by already established act and is looked at as a role model by up and coming talent. He was the pioneer of Latin Hip Hop, which has exploded, with the extremely popular, Regaetton over the past 4 years. Frost will serve as an ideal Vice President of Music Operations within Goldmark, due to his extensive musical knowledge, skills, history and experience. His presence on the Board of Executives will only serve to be advantageous to Goldmark's overall growth. Frost -- originally known as Kid Frost -- was a pioneer in the field of Latin hip-hop, cutting some of its very first records and helping to bring exposure to other bilingual MCs. Pioneering Latino rapper Frost only gets better with age. The veteran East Los Angeles rapper, who became a hip-hop icon in 1990 with his groundbreaking single "La Raza" has stepped up his game in the last decade, sharpening his lyrical skills and becoming an authority figure in the rap world. His success allowed such Latino rappers as Cypress Hill, Fat Joe, Big Pun to make substantial hip-hop inroads. His music features a hard-hitting mix of hard-core hip-hop, smoothed out cuts for the ladies and laid-back songs for cruising. This versatility is one of Frost's strengths, something that keeps him fresh. "The thing keeps my name in people's mouths is that I keep reinventing myself," Frost explains. "I don't just keep on making the same music I want to take bilingual hip-hop a trend I was the forefront of one step further while still kicking vivid rhymes about the code of the streets with authenticity." Frost is an original and knows about originality. Rapping since 1980 Frost scored his first record deal with Electrobeat Records thanks to the help of his long time mentor and frieend Ice-T. When deciding on his name, Frost decided to model his moniker after that of the man who helped start his career, choosing Frost since Frost comes before ice. Then known as Kid Frost, Frost became a regular on the car show circuit in the mid 1980's. When he released "La Raza" and his debut album, "Hispanic Causing Panic" a few years later, his visibility exploded and helped the Lowrider culture thrive in Southern California and eventually Worldwide. Frost says, "As I see the KRS-Ones and the LL Cool J's still in it, I won't budge. A lot of people might say that I'm too old. But I don't think it's your age or how you rap. It's your rap skills that keep you in the game. As long as we make that knocking Chevy music, we're going to stay in this rap game." Frost is a more than welcome addition to Goldmark's Board of Executives. This is one decision that is easy as it is profitable ----------------------- Say it with flowers. Weed it out. Stone cold sober. Put off the scent. Stone cold sober. Your all washed up. Raking it in. Rain, rain go away; come again some other day. Plain as water. Sweet as honey. Till the cows come home. Spill the beans. She's the apple of my eye. Spring forward fall back. Putting it in a nutshell. Shall I compare thee to a summer's day. The scythe ran into a stone. The squeaky wheel gets the grease. Root it out. Sweating blood. Up a tree. Tools of the trade. The way to a man's heart is through his stomach. Shit happens. Walking on thin ice. Root it out. You say potayto, I say potahto. You never miss the water till the well runs dry. You feel like a fish out of water. The stronger the breeze the stronger the trees. Rare as walking on water. Watered down. Weed out. Speak softly and carry a big stick. You can't teach an old dog new tricks. The way to a man's heart is through his stomach. Tools of the trade. So hungry I could eat a horse. You feel like a fish out of water. Up a tree. Shake like a leaf. Raking it in. Watch and wait. This is for the birds. From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Oct 4 13:24:28 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D6E416A492; Wed, 4 Oct 2006 13:24:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from MaggieStreetgs@arcor-ip.net) Received: from arcor-ip.net (dslb-088-073-196-004.pools.arcor-ip.net [88.73.196.4]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id CEC0D43D46; Wed, 4 Oct 2006 13:24:26 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from MaggieStreetgs@arcor-ip.net) Message-Id: <151505833.88477402@arcor-ip.net> From: "Chester Lord" To: , Date: Wed, 04 Oct 2006 15:24:26 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: mnag@freebsd.org, mm-test@freebsd.org, mod-avail@freebsd.org, mo@freebsd.org Subject: [mod-avail] ohare twitchyk X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Oct 2006 13:24:28 -0000 Energy Prices are near all time low, This is the best time to lock in a quality energy stock Introducing : WBRS Exchange Pinksheets Price: 0.05 3 Day Estimated : .50 ( +1000%) WILD BRUSH MAKES A MOVE! Wild Brush Acquires Additional Powder River Oil & Gas Lease. Who is Wild Brush? Wild Brush Energy is a diversified energy company whose primary goal is to identify and develop Oil & Coalbed Methane sites within the State of Wyoming. In addition, Wild Brush Energy continues to evaluate clean air alternative energy producing technologies such as Wind Power. Wild Brush trades in the U.S. under the symbol "WBRS." ADD THIS ENERGY STOCK TO YOUR LIST AND WATCH IT TRADE CLOSELY ON WEDNESDAY OCTOBER 4! Get In NOW !!! Schools out for summer. Sly as a fox. Rain, rain go away; come again some other day. The shoes on the other foot now. Your all washed up. The sun will shine into our yard to. Sow dry and set wet. Spill the beans. Still waters run deep. A rose is a rose is a rose. Walking on cloud nine. From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Nov 4 09:02:42 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD05F16A4E0 for ; Sat, 4 Nov 2006 09:02:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kyuxtoy@france-transactions.fr) Received: from france-transactions.fr (aix96.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl [83.25.231.96]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id CB4E043D6D for ; Sat, 4 Nov 2006 09:02:40 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from kyuxtoy@france-transactions.fr) Message-ID: <05c701c6ff88$3bbb12f0$4783a3e0@qextralinguisticy> From: "Caseyv Willsk" To: Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2006 10:02:40 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [mod-avail] Investor News j X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Caseyv Willsk List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2006 09:02:43 -0000 THIS IS NOT SPECULATION BUT REAL INFORMATION This advisory is based on exclusive insiders/agents information. (AVLN.OB) Avalon Energy Corporation has an undivided 85% working interest in the Shotgun Draw Prospect in the prolific natural gas producing Uinta Basin , located in the US Rockies, Utah . The lease comprises 13,189 acres with a potential 4 TCF recoverable gas and is overpressured by a 0.55 . 0.85 gradient. ON MONDAY NOV 6th: - Volume: 389,001 - Volume: + 50% - Price: +5.77% The key to any tade is buying low and selling high, WELL the energy market has bottomed out and time to get in is now. We specialise in calling market bottom and when it comes to energy THIS IS THE BOTTOM, SO GET IN FOLKS GET ON BOARD THIS TRAIN GET ON BOARD THIS TRAIN Oyler "adamantly denies involvement in this fire and in any of these fires," attorney Mark McDonald said outside court. "He's very distraught and scared ... The finger is pointing at him." Three firefighters died when the flames swept over their truck, and a fourth died soon after at a hospital. A fifth was taken off life support and died this week. The last time so many firefighters were killed battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. Bush said Democrats calling for withdrawing U.S. troops from Iraq aren't unpatriotic, just wrong. He said Democrats who voted against legislation to detain and interrogate suspected terrorists, the National Security Agency's eavesdropping program and the Patriot Act don't understand the stakes in the war on terror. Two days after the accident, the Federal Aviation Administration ordered small, fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with air traffic controllers. From owner-mod-avail@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Nov 5 11:07:45 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Delivered-To: mod-avail@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 773D616A492 for ; Sun, 5 Nov 2006 11:07:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lunchca@france-transactions.fr) Received: from france-transactions.fr (mel77-2-82-244-235-60.fbx.proxad.net [82.244.235.60]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id B81E043D8D for ; Sun, 5 Nov 2006 11:07:36 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from lunchca@france-transactions.fr) Message-ID: <045a01c70041$3aef72e0$9071f7f0@mpapyrusc> From: "Tyson Beaver" To: Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2006 12:07:47 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [mod-avail] In motion for New and just in g X-BeenThere: mod-avail@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Tyson Beaver List-Id: People who are available for moderator duties List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2006 11:07:45 -0000 LISTEN UP This advisory is based on exclusive insiders/agents information. (NHVP.PK) NHVP has provided investors with 1000% + gains during the real estate boom, and now with the sector at its bottom, is ready to provide with results yet again.. OCT 13th: Northeast Development Corp. to Receive Funding from European Investment Firm. Preliminary discussions suggest figures of -3 million with a combination of real estate and equity collateralization. GET IN ON MONDAY NOV 6th: at 08 cents its a STEAL - Volume: 8,000 - Volume: + 100% - Price: +100% The key to any tade is buying low and selling high, WELL the REAL ESTATE market has bottomed out and time to get in is now. We specialise in calling market bottom and when it comes to REAL ESTATE THIS IS THE BOTTOM, SO GET IN FOLKS GET IN NOW DONT REGRET LATER GET IN NOW DONT REGRET LATER Two days after the accident, the Federal Aviation Administration ordered small, fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with air traffic controllers. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed after Sunday's expected announcement of a verdict in the trial of former Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein, Iraq's defense minister has canceled leave for all army officers. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he strode into the darkened Springfield Exposition Center where volunteers handed out signs that said "Cards fans for Talent" -- a reference to the St. Louis Cardinals' World Series victory. Missouri's Senate race is intertwined with a ballot measure that would engrave the right to conduct embryonic stem cell research into the state constitution. McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it. (Watch Michael J. Fox back McCaskill on stem cells -- :32 )